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Furiax
Inscrit le: 16 Nov 2008 Messages: 16
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Posté le: Dim Nov 29, 2009 7:23 am Sujet du message: Question : Position of the church on duels |
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What is the position of the Church on duels.
It is sure that the Church dogma clearly states that we can not fight, but it is unclear with the appearances of intellectual duels where the line is cut. By prudence, I say that we can not duel especially because of the violence of it, especially for the loser who rarely goes out in very good shape.
Dernière édition par Furiax le Dim Nov 29, 2009 7:33 am; édité 1 fois |
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Furiax
Inscrit le: 16 Nov 2008 Messages: 16
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Posté le: Dim Nov 29, 2009 7:32 am Sujet du message: |
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Well I found my answer, the priests can use a charismatic duel.
I got my answer here : http://rome.lesroyaumes.com/viewtopic.php?t=16193
Cardinal Rehael : Les clercs peuvent utiliser le duel Casuistique qui se base sur le charisme. |
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Leia
Inscrit le: 14 Avr 2009 Messages: 719
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Posté le: Dim Nov 29, 2009 7:24 pm Sujet du message: |
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I myself would refer to the position taken by the ESI. Our Cardinal Primate Sepia has posted the following on the RK URACE forums on 25 Aug. 2009
Sepia a écrit: | Firstly the Church will not go against the King's ruling, it would be detrimental to the Church as a whole. Secondly the arena does not condome fights to the death, it is merely a sport to see who is the better fighter a fight of competence if you will.
So therefore while the Church does frown on it somewhat we will not hold an official stance against it.
OOC: We can't go against what the admins want for this game, and historically there would have been fights and sacrifices to the gods of donations and bread etc, therefore it is in keeping with the roleplay side of the game. |
I would still advise everyone not to fight. The Victor does not really get anything and the loser well losses a lot. _________________ aka Faith of Evesham<!----> |
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Sepia
Inscrit le: 01 Juin 2006 Messages: 439 Localisation: County Galloway, Scotland
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Posté le: Dim Nov 29, 2009 9:23 pm Sujet du message: |
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The only point I will stress is that ordained clergy cannot bear weapons, this includes in duels. _________________
Click here to see God! |
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Leia
Inscrit le: 14 Avr 2009 Messages: 719
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Posté le: Lun Nov 30, 2009 9:40 am Sujet du message: |
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If I may ask this then, given the prohibition against weapons (and shields) may I take it then our loss (us losing) is almost a certain outcome? Our opponent will surely be fully armed and armored, while we will have just our walking stick. _________________ aka Faith of Evesham<!----> |
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Sepia
Inscrit le: 01 Juin 2006 Messages: 439 Localisation: County Galloway, Scotland
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Posté le: Lun Nov 30, 2009 10:56 pm Sujet du message: |
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Yes Leia I imagine that would be the case, if clergy would like to duel I suggest they join a military order, or there are meant to be knowledge duels coded at some point, so attend them rather than the physical ones. _________________
Click here to see God! |
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landrick
Inscrit le: 03 Jan 2007 Messages: 59 Localisation: Bridgewater
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Posté le: Sam Déc 05, 2009 11:24 am Sujet du message: |
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I experimented myself the duel, because for me only god is able to kill or save. Then I don't see problem for duel because this is god which choose if somebody will dead. Moreover someone's say you can give some offers to church to optain god help and I think if god help fighter then by logic god is not opposed to duel.
Now I clearly change my idea's and the logic is maybe not the best way to be in god faith and heart is a better help than reason. My heart say that buying god help by offers is probably heretic. In this way duel is only a temptation to test our faith.
I regret my duel fight it was an error and I will accept what you decid for me to find the real faith and expiated. I'm only a man, I recognized my error and I wait your choice. I proposed first to sell my shield and my sword _________________
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Leia
Inscrit le: 14 Avr 2009 Messages: 719
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Posté le: Sam Déc 05, 2009 5:32 pm Sujet du message: |
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If I may suggest Brother Landrick if you wish to sell your sword and shield, you can donate the money from the sale to your town or County as a part of atonement. _________________ aka Faith of Evesham<!----> |
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Furiax
Inscrit le: 16 Nov 2008 Messages: 16
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Posté le: Dim Jan 31, 2010 11:46 pm Sujet du message: |
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May I add that bearing swords is allowed if you are a noble. I saw a priest bearing sword, and I was quite surprised until I went to read that exception to the rule. |
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Josephus Cardinal
Inscrit le: 11 Juin 2009 Messages: 1312 Localisation: City of Kendal, Westmorland
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Posté le: Mar Fév 02, 2010 6:27 pm Sujet du message: |
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Is this what you're referring to Your Excellency?
Citation: | Faculty of the National Seminary
The Sacraments of the Church - Ordination
Not to have a combat weapon , except ceremonial weapons and those of nobility or custom. |
_________________
From the abundance of the heart, the mouth speaks
[Cardinal Deacon of the British Consistory][Bishop In Partibus of Hieron][Primate of the British Isles][Parish Priest of Kendal] |
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Aishling O'Niall
Inscrit le: 04 Déc 2009 Messages: 486 Localisation: Port Láirge, An Mumhain
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Posté le: Mar Jan 04, 2011 1:55 am Sujet du message: |
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I have had three competitions in the arena. It is an organized sporting competition with those of equal ability and the conditions of the competition are agreed upon before hand. No weapons are used and there would be and is an agreed upon "donation" or none at all in the duels I take part in. Our group has also traveled to other countries for this and in doing so I have met many people affording me the chance to spread the word of the Almighty. Jah has smiled upon me all three times. |
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Leopold Cardinal
Inscrit le: 12 Sep 2010 Messages: 648 Localisation: Diocèse d'Utrecht
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Posté le: Mar Jan 04, 2011 12:47 pm Sujet du message: |
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Since at the arena one could sacrifice certain products in order to beg for help from Aristotelian Saints. It is not "illegal" by the Church.
Clerics, ordained members of the clergy, priests, should however not fight in duels. The article of the Canon Law which says a priest may not bear arms has been said numberous times here. That is correct.
But also the fact that a priest should not be competitif and restrain him or herself from "foolishness" like fighting as a priest in the arena. A priest is a shepherd and should watch over his sheep, the people of his or her parish. Because a priest who would fight bear handed... It is still fighting, and we preach a message of love, not violence. Even if it is "just for sport". We may not risk hurting a child of Jah. _________________
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Aishling O'Niall
Inscrit le: 04 Déc 2009 Messages: 486 Localisation: Port Láirge, An Mumhain
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Posté le: Mar Jan 04, 2011 5:44 pm Sujet du message: |
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So I should forgo any sporting challenge or competition of any sort? So no participation in any competition in my town? We have Winterfest coming up, it's full of competitions. My flock will find me as dull as a blunt axe and I'll get nowhere with them. I shall have to respectfully disagree on this point. |
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Leopold Cardinal
Inscrit le: 12 Sep 2010 Messages: 648 Localisation: Diocèse d'Utrecht
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Posté le: Mar Jan 04, 2011 6:00 pm Sujet du message: |
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Aishling O'Niall a écrit: | So I should forgo any sporting challenge or competition of any sort? So no participation in any competition in my town? We have Winterfest coming up, it's full of competitions. My flock will find me as dull as a blunt axe and I'll get nowhere with them. I shall have to respectfully disagree on this point. |
You should be able to place yourself above competion, especially violent ones. A competition of sheep shearing for example is "okay" compared to dueling. But as a clerc you should stand above games and competitions. That's just my opinion, sister. Not a Church doctrine.
And if you participate, don't forget to bless the games and ask God for strength, both for you and your competitors. _________________
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