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Plainte contre un milites

 
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Père Vauvout
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MessagePosté le: Jeu Sep 01, 2016 10:44 am    Sujet du message: Plainte contre un milites Répondre en citant

Un plainte contre Antonio Badoer Navarro della Vega [Tonius] a été déposé à la sainte Inquisition. Vu le statut de milites du défendeur, la Pénitencerie apostolique n'est pas compétente en premier ressort et vous transmet le dossier qui pourra être traité par les chambres disciplinaires de la congrégation.


niko a écrit:
Citation:

Demandeur(s) / denunciante(ti) / plaintiff(s) (RP and IG): Nicola da Padova

Accusé(s) / imputato(ti) /defendant(s) (RP and IG): Tonius Antonio Badoer Navarro della Vega

Fonctions occupées par l'accusé au sein de l'Église /
carica ricoperta dall'imputato nella Chiesa /
office held by the defendant in the Church:
Vice Ammiraglio della Marina Pontifica per le Zone del Sud, Primo Maresciallo Italico della Guardia Episcopale,
Lieu de résidence de l'accusé / residenza dell'imputato / residence of the defendant: Parenzo Repubblica di Venezia


Brève description du délit (quoi, où et quand il est arrivé) /
breve descrizione dell'accusa (cosa, dove e quando è successo) /
short description of the accusation (what, where and when happened):

Luogo : Dogana della Serenissima Repubblica di Venezia. Il Doge di Venezia Nicola in data 19 agosto nega il permesso di attracco alla nave Jacta capitanata da Aleja. con a bordo Mons. Tonius e altre guardie Episcopali (che al momento della richiesta di attracco non era specificato nè che erano GE e nè che avessero una missione.), perchè ritenuta pericolosa dalla Serenissima. Dopo quesi 3 giorni di negazione permessi e discussioni in dogana, il 22 agosto a Sera il Mons. Tonius riporta in dogana il documento che indica che la nave riporta la bandiera Pontificia quasi "imponendo" con autorità di quel documento e con in pungo il concordato fra venezia e chiesa, la richiesta di attracco che fino a quel momento era stato negato.
Si rammenta che i permessi negati sono stati alla nave indesiderata e in bl non pubblica della Serenissima battente bandiera laica. Al momento dell'imposizione, il Doge dopo consultazione in Maggior Consiglio, era pronto a dare attracco alla nave battente bandiera Pontificia.
Si ipotizza un abuso di potere che consiste nel voler costringere il doge a concedere un permesso altrimenti negato per motivi di sicurezza attribuendo a posteriori la bandiera pontificia.



Les noms d'autres témoins, si il y en a /
i nomi di altri testimoni, se ce ne sono /
names of other witnesses, if there are any:
S.S. I. Filippa Brandolini D'Adda

Preuves détenues par le demandeur /
testimonianza allegate in possesso del denunciante /
attached evidences in the hand of the plaintiff:

Autorizzazione a battere la bandiera pontificia.
Dogana della Serenissima Repubblica di Venezia


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Sébastien-Louis Vauvout, cardinal national suffragant, archevêque d'Auch, scripteur du Saint-Office

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Rodrigomanzanarez
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MessagePosté le: Jeu Sep 01, 2016 6:44 pm    Sujet du message: Répondre en citant

I take what is delivered and ask:

The case will be examined. Is there more evidence for this case? Especially regarding the main point of "abuse" of power? It is essential to have clear facts and proofs focussed on abuse. Accusations based on evidence only are hard to handle and decide, please understand.

I will check the Venice concordat and the Rules for Flags meanwhile.
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Père Vauvout
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MessagePosté le: Ven Sep 02, 2016 12:31 am    Sujet du message: Répondre en citant

My respect, your Eminence.

It is all the pieces that we have at the Holy Inquisition. There is not investigations from the Penitenciary because of the milites statute of "Tonius" ans his Eminence Stex thinks there is not «abuse ». If you share his analysis, it is equally possible, if the rules of disciplinary chambers permit it, that you considered the facts enough serious to choose an other count. To information :


Citation:




    Fiat justicia pereat mundus
    Rejection of the complaint against Tonius



    We, his Eminence Hull de Northshire, Roman Elector Cardinal, Vice-Chancellor of the Congregation of the Evangelization of Peoples, Cardinal-Governor and Count of Pesaro, Cardinal-Archbishop of Arles, Cardinal-priest of the parish of Sainte Adonia du Trastevere, Prefect of the Villa San Loyats, Commissioner of the Apostolic Penitentiary, General Chaplain of the Holy Armies, Great Teacher-Exorcist, Inquisitor, Delegate for the procedures and places of spreading of the Faith, Earl of Lundy and Lord of Eyguieres, Great-Officer of the Stars of Aristotle, Knight of the Order of Volpone, Landmeister of the Lordship of La Combe Bleue, Grand Master (Hochmeister) and Knight (Ritter) of the Teutonic Order, Rector of the Holy Order of Christos' Star,

    In our capacity as Commissioner of the Apostolic Penitentiary,

    Accompanied by His Eminence Stefano Maria Ludovico de'Giustiniani Borgia [IG : Stex86], Penitentiary chosen to assist us,


      Considering the complaint delivered to the Apostolic Penitentiary on the 29th of August 1464,

      Considering that Tonius Antonio Badoer Navarro della Vega is a member of the Holy Armies as a layman,

      Considering the jurisdiction of the Apostolic Penitentiary, which does not cover complaints against laymen who serve the Church,

      Have decreed and ordered, and by our present perpetual and definitive edict, declare, rule and order the rejection of the complaint against Tonius Antonio Badoer Navarro della Vega [IG: Tonius.], received on the 29th of August of this year.



    Given in Rome, the thirty-first day of the eight month of the Year of our Lord MCDLXIV.





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Tonius



Inscrit le: 07 Déc 2009
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MessagePosté le: Ven Sep 02, 2016 7:39 am    Sujet du message: Répondre en citant

Eminance, Brother and Sister,

Can I explain what happened???
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Rehael
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MessagePosté le: Sam Sep 03, 2016 2:19 pm    Sujet du message: Répondre en citant

Thank you Monseigneur Vauvout. We record the complaint and will give a response.

Tonius, of course you will. I write to you.

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Tonius



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MessagePosté le: Mar Oct 11, 2016 9:17 am    Sujet du message: Répondre en citant

Eminance Rehael,

has you come to a conclusion?
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Rodrigomanzanarez
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MessagePosté le: Mar Oct 11, 2016 3:16 pm    Sujet du message: Répondre en citant

Greetings my brother,

a decision is not yet made, I am sorry.
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Tonius



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MessagePosté le: Lun Oct 31, 2016 11:20 am    Sujet du message: Répondre en citant

Tonius a écrit:
Eminance Rehael,

has you come to a conclusion?

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Rodrigomanzanarez
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MessagePosté le: Jeu Nov 03, 2016 2:20 pm    Sujet du message: Répondre en citant

My brother,

to repeat:


You gave the Papal Flag, after you were rejected to enter Venice. For having someone from their blacklist with you. That brought the leadership in trouble for had to choose to oppose the church or either allow someone to enter they dont trust.

What we decided?

We have come to the conclusion that you have not committed a sin. Not at all. But you can improve your empathy and diplomacy. For you with a high rank as Vice-Admiral the levelling of course is high. Much higher as we expect from a non church person.

We dont say that you have been treated also perfectly. That was taken in account. But the focus is on you here and still we came to the conclusion you could have done better. As we mentioned, for us as CSA the levelling is higher as for others.

It would have been right to ask Venice earlier if they mind you enter. And as they rejected a person not to have set the Papal Flag. But to somehow find another way and if not possible dont take the person in. We know sometimes even asking earlier does not help. But in the end that happens. In such case escalate to the next level simply.

So how we get this from the table?

- You keep on helping in Venice whatever happens until the leadership of CSA allows you to leave. You wont critisize the Venecian leadership by yourself but forward that to us in case there is something unfair.
- After the war you will apologize once at the Doge. Short but wholehearted.

And thats simply it.

As I personnally understood that is bearable for you. So I ask for your cooperation to get this from the table.
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Tonius



Inscrit le: 07 Déc 2009
Messages: 623

MessagePosté le: Sam Jan 07, 2017 12:34 pm    Sujet du message: Répondre en citant

Rodrigomanzanarez a écrit:
My brother,

to repeat:


You gave the Papal Flag, after you were rejected to enter Venice. For having someone from their blacklist with you. That brought the leadership in trouble for had to choose to oppose the church or either allow someone to enter they dont trust.

What we decided?

We have come to the conclusion that you have not committed a sin. Not at all. But you can improve your empathy and diplomacy. For you with a high rank as Vice-Admiral the levelling of course is high. Much higher as we expect from a non church person.

We dont say that you have been treated also perfectly. That was taken in account. But the focus is on you here and still we came to the conclusion you could have done better. As we mentioned, for us as CSA the levelling is higher as for others.

It would have been right to ask Venice earlier if they mind you enter. And as they rejected a person not to have set the Papal Flag. But to somehow find another way and if not possible dont take the person in. We know sometimes even asking earlier does not help. But in the end that happens. In such case escalate to the next level simply.

So how we get this from the table?

- You keep on helping in Venice whatever happens until the leadership of CSA allows you to leave. You wont critisize the Venecian leadership by yourself but forward that to us in case there is something unfair.
- After the war you will apologize once at the Doge. Short but wholehearted.

And thats simply it.

As I personnally understood that is bearable for you. So I ask for your cooperation to get this from the table.



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Rodrigomanzanarez
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MessagePosté le: Dim Jan 15, 2017 10:43 pm    Sujet du message: Répondre en citant

Happy New Year, my brother. And Thanks
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Tonius



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MessagePosté le: Dim Jan 15, 2017 10:46 pm    Sujet du message: Répondre en citant

Rodrigomanzanarez a écrit:
Happy New Year, my brother. And Thanks

Thanks too you.
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