L'Eglise Aristotelicienne Romaine The Roman and Aristotelic Church

[Kalixtus]

According to Book 5, Part II, Article 2.8 of the CIC, we must conclude that the conditions are met to classify Cardinal Adonnis as inactive.

His last participation in any discussion was on 31 July. The inactivity is therefore far more advanced than it should be and it pains me to see the important work of the CNA in ruins. I have in education Poland and I want the great Eastern Kingdoms to grow closer to Rome.

For this we need an active CNA that works tirelessly. This is not the case.

It is necessary to declare the personal Adonnis inactive according to our laws and to remove and retire him from the position of Cardinal-Bishop and the position of Cardinal-Chancellor of the CNA.

Here is the law in force:



Citation:

Article 2.8: Cardinals who have been absent for more than one month, without warning of their absence, may be dismissed and, where appropriate, appointed Emeritus. e.g. : Absence means: - Not participating in the works of the Sacred College; - Not participating in the works of his Congregation for a Cardinal-Bishop; - Not participating in the works of his Consistory for a Cardinal-Priest or a Cardinal-Deacon; - The occasional presence without effective participation in the work under its jurisdiction; - Absence, disappearance, retirement or retrenchment In Gratebus.


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[Tymothé de Nivellus]

The fact that it always comes from you always makes you feel like you'll never change and that your only goal here is to kick everyone out and be alone...
You are deceitful and always on the lookout, your emblem is not the Lion but the Hyena...
Adonnis just retired, so you're picking on him... it's a little too easy. I oppose his immediate dismissal and I ask for more time for him to get back into shape after this deserved retirement.

If this is not the case, and he does not return, we will be able to notify him at that time.

If there is really a problem in his congregation, there is always a deputy, a prefect or someone who can intervene. When there is a problem in a congregation, we first turn to the Pope, he is more aware of the absences of the cardinal-bishops in charge of the congregations.
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Père Tymothé de Nivellus | Cardinal-Evêque de Saint Trufaldini à la Porte Latine | Camerlingue de Rome et Chancelier de la Chambre Apostolique | Archevêque SC d'Avignon et Archevêque de Bourges
"La puissance de Dieu donne toute sa mesure dans la faiblesse"
Cabinet du Cardinal

[Cathelineau]

We must be lucid, half of the cardinals, to say the least, do not do their job and this greatly penalizes the church. Some have taken pleasure in appropriating congregations and have not formed an acceptable successor to take up the torch.

The reality is simple, we have 5 cardinal bishops present to do the work of 16...

I have seen my complaints never dealt with at the inquisition for example, but we all see it, nothing is moving forward now. How many years have we been able to appoint a nuncio? That we don't take the bull by the horns to have the courage to change things? Today Kalixtus proposed a good thing for the election of the dean, it gives a bit of hope, but good for the rest..

1 or 2 active cardinal priests, the same for the deacons.

What do we do ?

It may be time to stop the pomp, we will have to reorganize the congregations if we want the work to be done correctly...
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[Tymothé de Nivellus]

It's not a question of being lucid or not, of course we have to move forward and we have to revitalize many things, but it's not by laying off people at the slightest absence that it will work. I was criticized and attacked when I suggested that you fire Neirin for a long-term absence, it had been several months... much longer than here and they defended it tooth and nail by making me seem like the wicked.

What I criticize here is that Kalixte does not do it for the "good of the church" but for his personal satisfaction of eliminating someone who hinders his ambitions of ascension...

He would not have had the same behavior with one of his acolytes

We know that Adonnis is a worker... we can also remain human... I simply ask that we can see with the Pope the possibilities before initiating a radical revocation!
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Père Tymothé de Nivellus | Cardinal-Evêque de Saint Trufaldini à la Porte Latine | Camerlingue de Rome et Chancelier de la Chambre Apostolique | Archevêque SC d'Avignon et Archevêque de Bourges
"La puissance de Dieu donne toute sa mesure dans la faiblesse"
Cabinet du Cardinal

[Kalixtus]

I thank you, Cathelineau, for your insightful analysis; we share some common points here.

I also want to express my gratitude to you, Tymothe, for your contribution. First and foremost, I thank you for ending your nearly month-long absence just in time. Absence in any form jeopardizes the stability of the Church, and that's precisely why we have laws in place. The fact that I have to constantly emphasize this is dramatic enough. Why do I do it? Because I'm one of the last cardinals who aren't too uncomfortable to point out the oversights and problems to the other cardinals. That's why I serve as the Dean of the Apostolic Signatura, as I have no fear of other cardinals.

Your analysis, dear Tymothe, presents several conclusions, which I will share with you and the College:


• Conclusion 1: You disregard the CIC and defend an absence of over 2 months. An absence that has consequences. The CNA is no longer functioning, a key congregation for the well-being of half of Europe. Adonnis's absence also means that the training of Portuguese clerics is no longer taking place, and students who cannot switch to another language are being turned away. Existing training programs are being disrupted.
  
  His absence is causing lasting damage to the Church on multiple levels, and your approval of this situation, dear Cardinal de Nivellus, is a dangerous position. The CIC has made it clear that this is not desired, which is why we can place someone in the status of Emeritus if a cardinal cannot or will not do so on their own.
  
  
• Conclusion 2: You misinterpret the hyena. It's telling that you see this magnificent and graceful animal in me. The only creature in the African savanna that can pose a threat to the lion and kill lions. I'm sorry, but I see your attempt to belittle me as a compliment because, yes, I have no fear of attacking a lion when the welfare of the Church is at stake, as it is here.
  
  
• Conclusion 3: Your loyalty to a friend like Adonnis evidently takes precedence over the laws and the welfare of the Church. I extend my congratulations on this unwavering stance. Few have the ability to ignore reality to satisfy their ideals, even if it means plunging half a continent into chaos.


I find your demand for more time for Adonnis, to put it mildly, disrespectful. The Church is crumbling because cardinals like you or Adonnis hide in eternal absences and do not properly lead their congregations or, in some cases, do not lead them at all.

Regarding the case of Neirin - Neirin did not lead a congregation as you or Adonnis did. Neirin was not the Dean of the Curia or a trainer of new clerics at the university.

Cardinals who do not fulfill their roles in the Curia, do not serve the Universal Church, and create damage from the top to the bottom, these are the disasters that are leading Rome to ruin. Ignoring the law is not the answer to this crisis.

I am sorry that you think that this attemp is focused on a private level - no - it is based on substance and needs to hold the church together, Tymothe. For that I am willing to ignore your insults in this response.

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[Francesco_maria]

"The rule is clear and the requirements are there. I have great love and respect for Card. Adonnis with whom I worked a lot in the Congregation of the New Apostolate but the situation is clear.

His absence may be legitimate but this does not mean that he is dead. However, we are talking about naming him emeritus, not taking him to the cemetery!

If he will return, which we all hope for, I don't think there would be any obstacles to giving him the office again. This has also happened for others in the past. I think for example of the case of card. Pamelita.

We cannot leave Congregations in suspense. Also because the New Apostolate as it is structured needs an active Chancellor."
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[Tymothé de Nivellus]

I just understood the ingenious deception you put in place ^^ you are cute... perverse, vicious and evil, but geniuses all the same...

looks at them without smiling...

You know, you can sing about my absences everywhere. They have always been justified before the Holy Father. And for my part, I have a prefect who supports me perfectly...
Now I've given my opinion, I find it a bit cavalier to jump at the first opportunity... I just hope others understand what's going on...
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Père Tymothé de Nivellus | Cardinal-Evêque de Saint Trufaldini à la Porte Latine | Camerlingue de Rome et Chancelier de la Chambre Apostolique | Archevêque SC d'Avignon et Archevêque de Bourges
"La puissance de Dieu donne toute sa mesure dans la faiblesse"
Cabinet du Cardinal

[Kalixtus]

Oh I have no doubt that you have declared your absence to His Holiness.

Just as I have no doubt that the laws have their validity and are also defended by His Holiness.

It is up to the College of Cardinals to make decisions. Your insults merely reflect your state of mind, Cardinal de Nivellus but not mine.

Ignorance of the issue - does lasting damage to the Church and as it says in Canon Law Book 5, Part II, Article 3.2:



Citation:

The Cardinals are the guardians of the Church. In this sense, they must see to the smooth running of the Holy Institution and the respect of the rules.

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[Cathelineau]

When I was created cardinal the rule on inactivity was followed to the letter and no one said anything. We then elected a successor, the store was doing very well. Adonnis is absent -> revoked and emeritus. he will find a seat again if he comes back with pleasure. The church is governed by the Curia not by prefects or secretaries.
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[Tymothé de Nivellus]

Excuse me, but I thought that it was the Pope who appointed and dismissed the cardinals, and that it was the Dean who presided over the sacred college...
You say yourself that I don't respect the rules, to get around them you have to know them, you are well placed to know that...
I haven't insulted you yet... even as crazy as you are, it's definitely something you would like...
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Père Tymothé de Nivellus | Cardinal-Evêque de Saint Trufaldini à la Porte Latine | Camerlingue de Rome et Chancelier de la Chambre Apostolique | Archevêque SC d'Avignon et Archevêque de Bourges
"La puissance de Dieu donne toute sa mesure dans la faiblesse"
Cabinet du Cardinal

[Ettore_Asburgo_D'Argovia]

The ancients said "dura lex, sed lex".
As unbearably rigorous as it may seem, we must respect the internal regulations that we have given ourselves for the greatest glory of the Church.
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+ Ettore Asburgo D'Argovia
Cardinale-Presbitero di San Barnaba a Ripa
Arcivescovo Metropolitano de L'Aquila
Decano del Tribunale della Rota Romana
Ufficiale dell'Ordine pontificio di Nicola V

[Fenice]

The rules must be followed and enforced, but in recent times, before making this kind of decision, an attempt has always been made to find out whether the person is ill and whether he or she is going to be active again now.
Let's do it now, a few days will not be the ruin of the Church.

Dear Cathelineau, it has been decades since the French-speaking Church directly managed politics, ignoring the Nunciature.
To appoint a Nuncio we need a student to take the course, I currently have one, what a miracle!
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[Roderic_]

They really surprise me, less than 24 hours and they have already argued a lot. One of my projects, once I take office, is to carry out an evaluation and debate among the active cardinals on the absent cardinals. Many have been very active over time and contributed to the church. That is why there is the figure of the emeritus, we must have a debate on this issue, but it is not yet one of October.
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[Cathelineau]

Or perhaps you are not capable or want to develop your congregation to bring it to a stable and operational functioning: there is no need for a nuncio per diocese, one or two per primaties is ample sufficient and he could perfectly well be a bishop...

For the congregation of Adonnis, the best solution would be to bring it back under the fold of the Congregation of the Affairs of the Century, since we are no longer able to appoint enough cardinals and its area of competence is linked to the diplomacy whose direction is normally assumed by the Congregation of the Affairs of the Century.
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[Kalixtus]

In principle, I am open to the merging of congregations that have been empty for so long.

I have also said to the Holy Father that key prefectures of the CSO can also be transferred to the CDF, so that the work on dogma and its cultivation is not permanently damaged, as is currently happening through the inactivity in this congregation.

We also have to face controversial discussions even if this would displease some cardinals.

I suggest, Cath, that we debate this issue separately from this issue of Cardinal Adonnis' retirement. That should take a broad course of discussion.

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